Experience switching to cream from injections? Low DHT haven't ever felt good on injections.

[WhiteMale]

I run labs about 90 minutes post topical, I try to get my numbers from the maximums instead of in a trough, partly because as I alluded I aromatase a lot and am sensitive to Estrogens, I try to manage that specifically as a peak value.

Too, I did a complicated days long set of labs in the past that showed me with exceptionally high numbers at ~90 minutes post cream (50mg/mL/2 clicks), but I was approaching sub 600 TT at ~4hours post application. At roughyl 8hrs post application I was in a Low T state.

I use my cream 4x (FOUR) times per day. I have low SHBG around 12-15 and metabolize very quickly, proven in those labs. Once per day was never going to work for me but that's the journey...what works for you.

 

[Tylurnt]

If I can make a suggestion, you may fare better with a single morning application of 100 mg than two split doses of 50 mg. The single morning application preserves some HPTA function in most men, which is often beneficial. It also creates a nice diurnal rhythm that is maximally supportive of sleep.

Historically, split dosing was thought to be desirable for the sake of stability. Now that we understand some maintenance of the HPT axis is possible with the single morning application, that is of greater value in most cases.

I have thought about this. My thought was get stable on the cream first, then slowly titrate down the evening dose to nothing. Im ultra sensitive to change and I think the hypogonadal state during the night might be rough for quite a while til it adapts since my body is use to stable levels. Right now, im actually sleeping a lot better than I did on injections.. few hours after application im OUT. I usually struggle to fall asleep and stay asleep. Now I only wake up once during the night to pee.

 

[Gibbon]

I have thought about this. My thought was get stable on the cream first, then slowly titrate down the evening dose to nothing. Im ultra sensitive to change and I think the hypogonadal state during the night might be rough for quite a while til it adapts since my body is use to stable levels. Right now, im actually sleeping a lot better than I did on injections.. few hours after application im OUT. I usually struggle to fall asleep and stay asleep. Now I only wake up once during the night to pee.

Maybe I missed it but where are you guys applying the cream? Do you move the sites around and have you ever had any absorption issues? Thank you.

 

[Tylurnt]

Maybe I missed it but where are you guys applying the cream? Do you move the sites around and have you ever had any absorption issues? Thank you.

Im applying it to the scrotum. Has greater absorption and more 5ar activity for DHT conversion which helps with e2 regulation. My DHT has always been below range on injections. Im only like 11 days in so I cant answer about absorption issues, but havent heard many absorption complaints of others, besides @Systemlord

 

[Tylurnt]

I run labs about 90 minutes post topical, I try to get my numbers from the maximums instead of in a trough, partly because as I alluded I aromatase a lot and am sensitive to Estrogens, I try to manage that specifically as a peak value.

Too, I did a complicated days long set of labs in the past that showed me with exceptionally high numbers at ~90 minutes post cream (50mg/mL/2 clicks), but I was approaching sub 600 TT at ~4hours post application. At roughyl 8hrs post application I was in a Low T state.

I use my cream 4x (FOUR) times per day. I have low SHBG around 12-15 and metabolize very quickly, proven in those labs. Once per day was never going to work for me but that's the journey...what works for you.

Ive heard from several other people that are on cream, once or twice per day that they feel no change. Even if labs show a low trough. Maybe it has something to do with whats left in the cells vs serum.

But im guessing you felt a trough at 2x per day?

 

[Tylurnt]

Been a couple weeks since ive last updated. Feeling way better the past 5 days, better than I have on injections. It was rough at first but its slowly getting better. Im at 100mg morning and 100mg night of HRT base cream. My brain is starting to work, brain fog has cleared, actually have energy and feel like I have some testosterone. Waiting on labs on this dosage, but was at 624 TT 4hrs after application when I was doing 75mg x2. Im not holding my breath because it could all go away, but it slowly getting better the past couple weeks is a good sign I think. My only complaint is sleep has been a little rough but otherwise I feel so much better.

 

[Systemlord]

If the cream doesn’t work, you might consider Jatenzo or Kyzatrex twice daily oral options. You’ll typically see a boost to DHT levels versus injections and higher Free T versus creams. Kind of a middle ground between injections and creams.

On oral T, consistency is the norm. Oral T has very similar half-lives to creams. Oral T bypasses the absorption problem with creams.

 

[Tylurnt]

If the cream doesn’t work, you might consider Jatenzo or Kyzatrex twice daily oral options. You’ll typically see a boost to DHT levels versus injections and higher Free T versus creams. Kind of a middle ground between injections and creams.

On oral T, consistency is the norm. Oral T has very similar half-lives to creams. Oral T bypasses the absorption problem with creams.

Yeah, that would be my next route. Im absorbing pretty good it seems. At 200mg a day , 100mg morning and night amd feeling better and better every day. It could change any day. But this is the longest and most positive experience ive had on TRT in the 18 months ive been on.

 

[Tylurnt]

The primary reason for HCG for me is that I do not feel well without it. I'm not an anxious person, but without the HCG I get turbo anxiety and this strange tired/wired feeling. Really unpleasant

That my balls don't shrink is a nice bonus.

Did you start HCG the same time as TRT? Im seeing A LOT of guys who say they dont feel well without HCG, but all of them started it the same time they started T... so you don't know if its a withdrawal, or that they actually don't feel good on TRT without it.

 

[Mr.63]

Does anyone have prostate problems on the cream?

 

[Tylurnt]

Update. Had a 7 day stretch where I was starting to feel lots better. Had energy to get out of bed and get things done and had a positive outlook. That ended yesterday waking up with anxiety. And this morning, woke up with even more anxiety. Im not really sure where to go from here. My body may still be trying to balance out. Currently 100mg morning and 50mg night on scrotum. Was at 100mg morning and night, but dropped to 50mg nightly 4 days ago to see if it would help with sleep. Now thinking about it, things did go down hill since I lowered the nightly dose. Going to get labs tomorrow and see whats going on

 

[Phil Goodman]

Update. Had a 7 day stretch where I was starting to feel lots better. Had energy to get out of bed and get things done and had a positive outlook. That ended yesterday waking up with anxiety. And this morning, woke up with even more anxiety. Im not really sure where to go from here. My body may still be trying to balance out. Currently 100mg morning and 50mg night on scrotum. Was at 100mg morning and night, but dropped to 50mg nightly 4 days ago to see if it would help with sleep. Now thinking about it, things did go down hill since I lowered the nightly dose. Going to get labs tomorrow and see whats going on

You’ve been advised to stick with a protocol to let your body adjust yet you insist on constantly changing your protocol. And when you get labs tomorrow that will just be a snapshot of that point in time.

You’ve struggled with protocols for over a year then found one where you felt great but it had a negative inspection in your sleep. For one, it’s possible your body would’ve adjusted to the protocol and your sleep quality would’ve improved by itself given time. Secondly, there are other tools to use on various fronts. Your first approach should not be to just adjust dosage, frequency, or application method whenever an issue arises… particularly true for people who have had a hard time finding a good protocol. There are all kinds of things that can assist with sleep, from habits to diet to vitamins/minerals to supplements and other things. Did you try anything else to assist on that front, or did you just say “screw it I’ll drop my dose by 25%”?

One of the things I’ve added recently that seems to have helped with sleep is PS Caps from Life Extension. I very rarely have sleep issues it always resolves within a week or so, so I wasn’t even adding it for that but rather for the cognitive benefits. It’s only been about a week and a half but my sleep has been really good. Even more so than usual and I almost always get 7+ hours any way. Not sure if it would help, but I noticed that along with the cognition it also blunts cortisol, so it may help you on both fronts(anxiety and sleep).


Phosphatidylserine (PS): Sleep, Stress & Cognition Benefits
Phosphatidylserine is a phospholipid naturally found in cell membranes, particularly concentrated in the brain. Here’s what the research shows across three key areas:
SLEEP
Cortisol regulation is the primary sleep mechanism — PS blunts nighttime cortisol spikes that can fragment sleep and cause early waking. Studies suggest it may improve sleep quality and duration, particularly in people whose sleep is disrupted by overtraining or chronic stress. It doesn’t act as a sedative; rather, it supports sleep by calming the HPA (hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal) axis.
STRESS
PS is one of the few supplements with solid evidence for blunting the cortisol response to physical and psychological stress. A well-cited study found that 400–800 mg/day significantly reduced cortisol and ACTH levels after exercise-induced stress. It also appears to reduce subjective feelings of stress and anxiety, likely through its role in dampening HPA axis overactivation. Athletes use it specifically to prevent overtraining syndrome, which is driven by chronically elevated cortisol.
COGNITION
Memory: PS has FDA-qualified health claim language supporting its role in reducing cognitive decline in the elderly. Multiple trials show improvements in verbal memory, recall, and learning. Attention & focus: Studies in children with ADHD and in healthy adults show improvements in attention, concentration, and processing speed. Age-related decline: PS levels in the brain naturally drop with age. Supplementation appears to partially restore neuronal membrane integrity and neurotransmitter signaling (acetylcholine, dopamine). Neuroplasticity: PS supports nerve growth factor (NGF) activity, which is important for synaptic maintenance and repair.
DOSING
Most studies use 100–300 mg/day for general cognitive support. Higher doses (400–800 mg/day) are used for cortisol/stress blunting. It is generally well-tolerated; soy-derived and sunflower-derived forms are the most common. Effects on cognition tend to build over 4–8 weeks of consistent use. Overall, PS has a stronger evidence base than most nootropics, particularly for stress resilience and memory in aging populations.

 

[Tylurnt]

You’ve been advised to stick with a protocol to let your body adjust yet you insist on constantly changing your protocol. And when you get labs tomorrow that will just be a snapshot of that point in time.

You’ve struggled with protocols for over a year then found one where you felt great but it had a negative inspection in your sleep. For one, it’s possible your body would’ve adjusted to the protocol and your sleep quality would’ve improved by itself given time. Secondly, there are other tools to use on various fronts. Your first approach should not be to just adjust dosage, frequency, or application method whenever an issue arises… particularly true for people who have had a hard time finding a good protocol. There are all kinds of things that can assist with sleep, from habits to diet to vitamins/minerals to supplements and other things. Did you try anything else to assist on that front, or did you just say “screw it I’ll drop my dose by 25%”?

One of the things I’ve added recently that seems to have helped with sleep is PS Caps from Life Extension. I very rarely have sleep issues it always resolves within a week or so, so I wasn’t even adding it for that but rather for the cognitive benefits. It’s only been about a week and a half but my sleep has been really good. Even more so than usual and I almost always get 7+ hours any way. Not sure if it would help, but I noticed that along with the cognition it also blunts cortisol, so it may help you on both fronts(anxiety and sleep).


Phosphatidylserine (PS): Sleep, Stress & Cognition Benefits
Phosphatidylserine is a phospholipid naturally found in cell membranes, particularly concentrated in the brain. Here’s what the research shows across three key areas:
SLEEP
Cortisol regulation is the primary sleep mechanism — PS blunts nighttime cortisol spikes that can fragment sleep and cause early waking. Studies suggest it may improve sleep quality and duration, particularly in people whose sleep is disrupted by overtraining or chronic stress. It doesn’t act as a sedative; rather, it supports sleep by calming the HPA (hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal) axis.
STRESS
PS is one of the few supplements with solid evidence for blunting the cortisol response to physical and psychological stress. A well-cited study found that 400–800 mg/day significantly reduced cortisol and ACTH levels after exercise-induced stress. It also appears to reduce subjective feelings of stress and anxiety, likely through its role in dampening HPA axis overactivation. Athletes use it specifically to prevent overtraining syndrome, which is driven by chronically elevated cortisol.
COGNITION
Memory: PS has FDA-qualified health claim language supporting its role in reducing cognitive decline in the elderly. Multiple trials show improvements in verbal memory, recall, and learning. Attention & focus: Studies in children with ADHD and in healthy adults show improvements in attention, concentration, and processing speed. Age-related decline: PS levels in the brain naturally drop with age. Supplementation appears to partially restore neuronal membrane integrity and neurotransmitter signaling (acetylcholine, dopamine). Neuroplasticity: PS supports nerve growth factor (NGF) activity, which is important for synaptic maintenance and repair.
DOSING
Most studies use 100–300 mg/day for general cognitive support. Higher doses (400–800 mg/day) are used for cortisol/stress blunting. It is generally well-tolerated; soy-derived and sunflower-derived forms are the most common. Effects on cognition tend to build over 4–8 weeks of consistent use. Overall, PS has a stronger evidence base than most nootropics, particularly for stress resilience and memory in aging populations.

I agree with you. Im gonna stick where im at. Im not giving up. I did just adjust by feel. I thought very high T levels at night weren't a great thing. But I need to pick a dose and stick there.

 

[Tylurnt]

You’ve been advised to stick with a protocol to let your body adjust yet you insist on constantly changing your protocol. And when you get labs tomorrow that will just be a snapshot of that point in time.

You’ve struggled with protocols for over a year then found one where you felt great but it had a negative inspection in your sleep. For one, it’s possible your body would’ve adjusted to the protocol and your sleep quality would’ve improved by itself given time. Secondly, there are other tools to use on various fronts. Your first approach should not be to just adjust dosage, frequency, or application method whenever an issue arises… particularly true for people who have had a hard time finding a good protocol. There are all kinds of things that can assist with sleep, from habits to diet to vitamins/minerals to supplements and other things. Did you try anything else to assist on that front, or did you just say “screw it I’ll drop my dose by 25%”?

One of the things I’ve added recently that seems to have helped with sleep is PS Caps from Life Extension. I very rarely have sleep issues it always resolves within a week or so, so I wasn’t even adding it for that but rather for the cognitive benefits. It’s only been about a week and a half but my sleep has been really good. Even more so than usual and I almost always get 7+ hours any way. Not sure if it would help, but I noticed that along with the cognition it also blunts cortisol, so it may help you on both fronts(anxiety and sleep).


Phosphatidylserine (PS): Sleep, Stress & Cognition Benefits
Phosphatidylserine is a phospholipid naturally found in cell membranes, particularly concentrated in the brain. Here’s what the research shows across three key areas:
SLEEP
Cortisol regulation is the primary sleep mechanism — PS blunts nighttime cortisol spikes that can fragment sleep and cause early waking. Studies suggest it may improve sleep quality and duration, particularly in people whose sleep is disrupted by overtraining or chronic stress. It doesn’t act as a sedative; rather, it supports sleep by calming the HPA (hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal) axis.
STRESS
PS is one of the few supplements with solid evidence for blunting the cortisol response to physical and psychological stress. A well-cited study found that 400–800 mg/day significantly reduced cortisol and ACTH levels after exercise-induced stress. It also appears to reduce subjective feelings of stress and anxiety, likely through its role in dampening HPA axis overactivation. Athletes use it specifically to prevent overtraining syndrome, which is driven by chronically elevated cortisol.
COGNITION
Memory: PS has FDA-qualified health claim language supporting its role in reducing cognitive decline in the elderly. Multiple trials show improvements in verbal memory, recall, and learning. Attention & focus: Studies in children with ADHD and in healthy adults show improvements in attention, concentration, and processing speed. Age-related decline: PS levels in the brain naturally drop with age. Supplementation appears to partially restore neuronal membrane integrity and neurotransmitter signaling (acetylcholine, dopamine). Neuroplasticity: PS supports nerve growth factor (NGF) activity, which is important for synaptic maintenance and repair.
DOSING
Most studies use 100–300 mg/day for general cognitive support. Higher doses (400–800 mg/day) are used for cortisol/stress blunting. It is generally well-tolerated; soy-derived and sunflower-derived forms are the most common. Effects on cognition tend to build over 4–8 weeks of consistent use. Overall, PS has a stronger evidence base than most nootropics, particularly for stress resilience and memory in aging populations.

I have some PS. What dose would you reccomend? I tried it many months ago and thought it helped but had rebound anxiety in the morning

 

[Tylurnt]

My H&H are really high. Im wondering if its whats causing the symptoms? Feeling so discouraged... never had it this high before. This was 5 hrs after application and TT was only 498. Do you think this is part of the adjustment period and it go down?

 

[Dicky]

Did you start HCG the same time as TRT? Im seeing A LOT of guys who say they dont feel well without HCG, but all of them started it the same time they started T... so you don't know if its a withdrawal, or that they actually don't feel good on TRT without it.

I started TRT twice. The first time w/out HCG I lasted 9 months and felt so bad I had to stop taking it. The second time around I started TRT w/ HCG and felt much better

 

[Phil Goodman]

I have some PS. What dose would you reccomend? I tried it many months ago and thought it helped but had rebound anxiety in the morning

I’ve just started with 100 mg since that’s what each capsule is, but I think the dose can be anywhere from 100-400. I’d just start with the 100 mg dose and see how it goes. What exactly do you mean by “rebound anxiety” and how did you attribute it to the PS?

 

[Dicky]

Does anyone have prostate problems on the cream?

I do, but those problems predated when I started using cream

 

[galvarez]

Does anyone have prostate problems on the cream?

None in the past year and a half I’ve been on the cream. My PSA is almost always under 1.0.

 

[Mr.63]

I do, but those problems predated when I started using cream

Did it got worse on the cream?
Are u still doing the hybrid? If i remember correctly.. 20mg a week test e or c, with 100mg cream in the am?